00:00 Chris Grainger
Welcome to the lion within us, a podcast, serving Christian men who are hungry to be the leaders they’re predestined to be. I’m your host, Chris Grainger. Let’s jump in. All right, guys. Welcome. Welcome to the big episode this week. And we’re gonna be talking about overcoming insecurity. There you go.

Overcoming insecurity, guys. We’re gonna be digging deep into this before we jump any further. You know what we gonna do on the line within us? We’re gonna star out in God’s word. So as Isaiah 40 verse 31, here we go. But those who hope, remember, or weight, you can use weight right there and the Lord will remove their strength.

They were sore on wings like Eagles. They will run and not grow weary. They will walk and not be fainted. Love that scripture. Don’t go straight to the Eagle part. Remember on S SCO, go back the didn’t listen to that. Go check that spiritual kickoff. I really unpacked that scripture and really focused on the first part of it.

We have to hope and wait in the Lord. And sometimes as men, that can be hard, but I get it guys. You wanna soar? You wanna run? You wanna walk, trust his timing. Remember, you know, you may, you may get the yes, but let’s make sure we get the go. All right. So for today, who are we gonna be talking to? So excited to guys to bring this to you.

We got his name is Michael McReedy. He is a fulltime executive coach. Okay. And he helps growth minded business owners and CEOs discover the clarity and perspective to big words, clarity and perspective. They need to lead with confidence and wisdom. Okay. Kind of sounds like somebody we should be talking to.

Right guys. He also hosts the business of living podcasts actually live in L I V I N podcast. If you wanna search that out there right now, He leads masterminds groups with men as well. And he also enjoys, uh, hosting guests at his Airbnb properties. So he’s got some pretty cool things going on there. He has intentionally built his business to allow significant amount of flexibility from making memories with his family.

Love it, love that. And Michael and his beautiful wife, Lydia, they lived in Western New York. They had three kids. That’s right. 3, 7, 5, 4 year old that’s gunner Skylar and Asher. Let’s tell you what, he’s got a lot going on at home. Michael’s a great guy. As soon as I connected with him, I’m like, bro, you gotta come on the line with innocent.

Share, give us some insight. So I’m not gonna hold you back anymore. All right guys, let’s get into it

for our listeners. Would you mind just sharing a little bit about your background, your story to, to what led you to, to where you are right now?

02:38 Michael McGreevy
Yeah, I, I have a feeling today’s, conversation’s gonna make. Other men feel better about themselves, just because of how okay. My story has unfolded. Um, but I hope it’s an encouragement, but so I was raised in a, in a solid family.

My parents are believers and they have been for a long time. And so I’ve had that foundation, but for some reason early on, I really struggled with insecurity and fear and anxiety, and just kind of a general discomfort with who I was and, and, uh, just kind of a shaky foundation within myself. And, uh, the way that manifest manifested itself was often in school.

I was frightened even to answer questions in class. Like if I got called on, I would clam up and turn all red and that’s just the type of person I was super fearful and cowardly and, and scared. And that’s, that’s that story that I told myself throughout my whole C. I had a great childhood, but this was going on inside me for one reason or another.

And it showed up in a lot of different areas of life. And so I’m athletic, I’m into music and sports and that sort of thing. And I feel like I, I could only give just a small portion of, of what I really had to offer in those different areas. And, and it was really frustrating. I was, um, just really struggled socially in school and, and just had a hard time in my childhood, feeling comfortable in my own skin and feeling confident in who I was and in what I was doing.

And so, anyway, my story was interrupted by a tragedy and this is well after college. When I got into college, I was, I was still lost and, and really acting out in a number of different ways. And that included just partying too much. I was part of the football team too. Was in with a bad crowd and just was really lost in college.

So after somehow graduated, it was a miracle that I did graduate from college, but after I graduated, I still didn’t know what I wanted to do. I felt kinda lost. And, and so I immediately got a job after college, cuz my parents were like, Hey, you wanna hang out here? You’re gonna start paying some rent. So like right.

All right, loud and clear, I better start working. So I got a job on a framing crew, working construction. So building houses and it was great. We, we were outside. It’s hard work. I was learning. Um, I was enjoying, it, had nothing to do with what I studied in college, but I had a job and I was starting to make some money.

And then one day on the job I was working with another friend and he was a bright kid. He’s quarterback of the high school football team. He was, um, on his way to becoming a secret service or a secret service agent. So he was often being visited on the construction site by people who are interviewing him, just a solid bright kid with a, with a great future.

So I’m working with him one day on the second floor of a house that we’re framing together and I’m watching him, he’s walking a brace off of a Gable end. And as he is walking back, he stepped back into the stairwell and fell two stories down into the basement. And I was locked eyes with him as he was falling down.

And I ran over to that hole, which we were starting to build the wall around that stairwell. So we had to take off the temporary railing and he had walked right into it. I look over the edge and his body is in a slump he’s unconscious on the basement floor. And so remember now I’m, I’m a pretty anxious cowardly sort of feeling person at the time.

So, I mean, I was kind of freaking out really, and, but I ran down into the basement and tried to revive him. I gave him CPR when you have head trauma, you know, oftentimes you throw up and that’s what happened with him. And so it was a really traumatic sort of scene and I’m giving him mouth to mouth, trying to revive him.

Anyway, he ended up dying in my arms, which was just indescribable. That experience. It’s really difficult to put it into words. And on top of that, I was in a pretty bad spot, myself, just kind of feeling pretty hopeless about life, confused, not knowing what to do. And then later in that evening, my boss and I went to the hospital.

To go visit his parents and to see they had brought him to the hospital. I knew he was gone, but they had brought him to the hospital and I’m standing there in the hospital, in front of his parents. I could see the hospital room, the door still open. And he is laying there under a sheet in the hospital room and his parents are undone just crawling on the ground.

Just like what happened to my son? What happened to my son? And here I am an insecure 21 year old kid, red in the face. And I couldn’t even say a word. I just stood there and said, I’m sorry. I was completely frozen. I just remember that being the worst day of my life to this day, it probably still is. And so, uh, if I wasn’t at rock bottom coming outta college and not having much direction, that really brought me there.

And yeah, it of course added to my anxiety and my. Um, just overall sense of not being okay. And so then, uh, a few months later, uh, we’re on a family vacation and we used to go to South Carolina every year, stay at this little, um, state park called hunting island, state park. And I was, uh, boogie boarding, cuz that’s that was my favorite thing to do is just get out in the waves.

I’m up here in Buffalo, New York fighting. Yeah, the snowflakes all year. So to get into the ocean and ride some waves on a boogie board was just like pure bliss. It was getting away from it all. And uh, then I realized I was having a little trouble getting back in and they don’t tell us about UN they don’t tell us about under toe or Riptide up there in New York.

So apparently that’s what was going on and I’m getting pulled back out into the ocean and I’m starting to get a little worried, like, man, what if I don’t make it in I’m this is pretty powerful force here. So I decided I’m gonna head back into the shore and get out of the ocean. And I had to fight pretty hard to get out.

And when I finally did I’m, I’m exhausted and I’m back on the beach. And, and I look back out at the ocean and I see two family friends. They’re a girl in middle school and a girl in high school. And we were on vacation with them, known them forever. And they’re way out in the ocean and they’re waving their arms, Brian like asking for help and they’re getting swept farther and farther out.

So, uh, my first thought Chris is, I’m gonna save the day. I’m the man, let’s go take care of this. No, not, not at all, not even close. My first thought is I better find somebody that can help these girls cuz I can’t do anything about it. And this isn’t a public beach, really? It’s pretty remote. So there’s no lifeguards or anything like that.

There really wasn’t anyone around at all. And this is where I think God stepped in and really helped me see the situation in a way that that really helped. Um, I immediately thought of this guy who had died in the construction accident in that time that I had to sit in front of his parents at the hospital and they were asking me what happened to my son.

I realized that I would be having that same conversation if something wasn’t done about these two girls, and I would have to have that conversation with two very close family friends, and it’d be about two of their daughters. And so the thought of right, doing that again, reliving the worst day of my life, especially in the condition I was in.

No thanks. So I was, I pretty much. Said, I would rather die in the ocean than have that conversation again. And you know what? I wouldn’t have to deal with my insecurity and my feeling of being lost and the anxiety I was experiencing and the all that kind of stuff would just be gone. And so it started to sound pretty attractive, drowning in the ocean versus having a conversation with those girls’ parents.

And so that’s when the decision became clear that between those two options, I think I’d rather drown. So that’s what I decided to do is to go drown and cuz I had no belief that I would be able to do anything about it. But, uh, it’s a funny thing when, when you kind of, when you assume that you’re going to die anyway, you know, why not just, uh, use all the energy you do have and see where it takes you.

And so I did that. I just kept swimming and swimming and. Then I started to get closer to these two girls and I started thinking, wait a minute, I might actually be able to help them. We might actually survive this. And that was a new thought. That was a new idea. And I finally made it out to them and I don’t know what happened if it was out of fear or survival, but I just looked at them and said, we are gonna make it in.

Don’t stop swimming and kicking until we have sand under our feet. And, uh, they, you know, they’re shake up. One of them was crying and, you know, we’re all getting hit by waves at the same time and kind of getting pulled, pulled along and we all just started swimming and kept going. We’d get broken up again by a wave and sort of spread out and pulled back a little bit.

Then we’d swim, swim a little bit more. And by this time I’m exhausted. Right? Cause I, I already got out of the ocean cause I was fighting the waves. I, I had nothing left, but we kept swimming, kept swimming. Um, and before we knew it, we felt sand under our feet and all three of us just like kind of tumbled into the short, just exhausted, like, oh my gosh, we almost just died.

It was kind of the, the overwhelming feeling among all three of us, but something really powerful happened to me in that moment. And it was just a little whisper and I think it was God speaking to me. And for the first time in my life, I heard you have something to offer. There is strength in you and you’re gonna offer that to other people.

I have some work for you to do and. That was so refreshing for me to hear, because here I am my entire life telling this other story in my own head of URA coward, you’re fearful. You don’t have anything to offer, like all this negative sort of self talk that was really dominating my thoughts up until this point.

So that was a completely new message and it sounded good. Like I loved it, it, it nourished my soul to hear those words. And that was a major shift in what my wife was about from that point forward. I feel like I’ve been talking a long time here. So give you a chance to chime in if you want

14:47 Chris Grainger
Chris. I know.

I mean, I’m. This is a, a powerful story. I am curious. So what was the timeline between the first tragedy and this second potential tragedy that you know, where you saved these girls? You said it sounded like it was not that long in between them. It

15:03 Michael McGreevy
wasn’t. So that was in the fall, the tra the first tragedy.

And then I think we usually went VA on vacation around Easter. So the following April.

15:16 Chris Grainger
Oh, wow. Okay. So, I mean, you had a lot happening there, a short period of time. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. Wow. I mean, and you know, God, you mentioned he, it sounded like a whisper. I mean, that’s, that’s it right? I mean, that’s when he speed, that’s why we have to be still so we can hear those whispers.

So, man, that’s, that’s amazing. So from, from there, was it an immediate switch? Like, you know, you, you had that anxiety, stress. All that stuff happening. Was it, was it like a light, light switch happening or was it still a process to build up? Cause now you coach executives and you know, you’re very confident, you know, secure individuals.

So maybe talk about the, the progress to where you are now. Yeah.

15:58 Michael McGreevy
It was not an immediate switch. No, there’s a bunch

16:01 Chris Grainger
of guys just went, oh man. I was hoping there was a switch I could flip. Right.

16:06 Michael McGreevy
yeah. But I think what’s important to hear is that it was a, it was immediate, the mental shift was immediate mm-hmm

So that change in thinking that change in understanding who God is and who you are and what he has for you. Um, that changes everything because it changes where, what your eyes are fixed upon from that point forward. Right? So my eyes were fixed upon how I was missing the mark and how I wasn’t good enough and how I was afraid and fearful.

And I lacked confidence in all those things. That was where my eyes were focused. And the shift in mindset now switched my view and my focus on, well, God’s got work for me to do. If he’s wants to use me in some way, that’s what I need to be about. And so I’m gonna run in that direction. And that was a long and difficult road.

And that road’s, let’s be honest, that road is not over yet. I’m still searching and listening and hearing that’s a daily practice for me. But in those several years after that experience, it looked like trying a lot of different things, getting a lot of different perspectives, talking to a lot of people and failing at some things too, frankly, trying some different careers that weren’t a good fit for me and, and learning from those experiences.

And then, um, eventually. Um, one day I had lost my job in one of my missteps in, in this exploration process, I was working for a nonprofit teaching construction skills to at risk young adults. And, um, I got laid off and so I was working on my house and I’m outside scraping my house, getting ready to paint it.

Somebody came along and asked if that’s what I do now, here I am without a job needing something, some work. So my answer was, yeah, absolutely. What do you, what do you need me to do? So I ended up painting another person’s house and then while I was working on that house, someone else asked me if they could work on their house.

And then that kept happening until I had a full blown construction company. So I was, I had a home remodeling business, had employees and. Was ended up doing additions and bathrooms and kitchens and full renovations and that sort of thing. And, um, so it’s funny how things can that ex exploration process can lead to different opportunities and they may not be the opportunity for the rest of your life.

Um, but you’re gonna learn something through it and you’re gonna gain some skills and perspective through that experience that will lead to your next step. And that’s exactly what happened. So as I’m working, I, I was very into growing myself. And so I’d often listened to podcasts just like this one. Um, so while I’m swinging the hammer out on the job, I would have different podcasts on just learning about how to be better and improve myself.

And I listened to Dan Miller’s podcast. It was, um, 48 days to the work you love. And he talked about this whole industry of coaching and how you can. Build a flexible lifestyle and help others move forward at the same time and help them see their potential. And that just resonated with me so deeply that I thought, man, how can I do that?

I mean, you can get paid for working with people and helping them and see them experience breakthroughs and victories. I mean, that sounds incredible. And so as soon as he had a coach training program, I jumped in a car and drove to Nashville to go to that conference. And as a result of that, I started building a coaching business right after attending that conference.

So that’s kind of how that led into what I’m doing today.

20:20 Chris Grainger
So, I mean, were you doing, did you still have the construction business going and you were, this is kinda like a side hustle type deal that you had to to build up? It

20:28 Michael McGreevy
was, I was so convinced that it was gonna be my full time gig. That I jumped way too early.

I’ll be, I’ll be honest. I, you know, I tend to be overly positive sometimes and right. So in my mind, I was gonna get a couple coaching clients. It was gonna take off. I was going to be awesome and I’d be set for the rest of my life. That’s, that’s kind of how I was feeling at the time, but, you know, I had enough coaching clients to step away from construction.

And so I, I burned the ships. I closed my construction business, hung up. The tool belt said to all my clients I’m out. And, um, after those client coaching experiences ended, I had bills to pay and there were no new clients. And so I was freaking out. I mean, I, I was newly married and had a kid on the way.

And I had no business coming in and I had already closed up shop on my, um, in construction business. And so that was a frightening time. So I, it was humbling too. I had to go back out and knock on doors and try to get more construction jobs just to pay the bills.

21:52 Chris Grainger
Michael some’s coming to mind that, that I really, I brought up in the spiritual kickoff.

I’ll take a quick break.

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during the, the spiritual kickoff, you know, I verse and you, and you provided me this verse out of Isaiah. Right? And, but when I, when I started studying that scripture, you know, so many guys go straight to, you know, we’re gonna soar like Eagles, right. That’s where they go in that scripture. But I went to the beginning of the scripture where it says, but those who wait in the Lord.

And one thing that, that came up, you know, it was revealed to me, was studying the scripture is sometimes God is gonna tell us, yes. Like to your point on the passion. Yes. You need to do this. You need to coach. You need to coach people, but it’s too often, guys, we don’t get the go. You know, we, we, we’re not waiting for the, for him to tell us, go, you know, we’ll get an, an affirmation of yes to do this, but maybe it’s, we’re pushing the timing if you will, when we, and we’re not getting his, his, his blessing to go yet, maybe that sounds like maybe that’s where, where you were, you know, right there at the beginning, you had the passion of the, yes.

You know, you wanted to do this, but the go was more of your timing on the go

23:49 Michael McGreevy
yeah. I think you nailed it, Chris. That’s absolutely right. Um, you know, passion isn’t enough and, and there’s so much weight given to that idea, especially in our culture, find your passion and the money you’ll follow. Right. Right.

There’s that’s like a common thing that you hear, but, uh, passion isn’t enough. You have to work at it too. You have to develop those skills. You have to master your craft. And I was living on a dream and some passion when I launched my coaching business and yeah. Passion can help people move forward. But there’s there’s skill and there’s a depth of, um, mastery that you wanna reach before you really put all your eggs in that basket and step into it fully.

Yeah,

24:36 Chris Grainger
absolutely. And you know, and you were mentioning earlier in your story that, you know, you, you, you were brought up in a Christian home, you were struggling with that anxiety, but one thing that kept standing out, even throughout your story, you were telling you would, you would say to yourself that, you know, you’re not good enough.

You’re not smart enough. You know, you can’t do this. And I see too many guys and including myself, you know, we’re, we’re our worst enemies, man. I mean, mentally we, we, we can talk ourselves out of something in a minute. And I think that is one of Satan’s tools that is that, that doubt that he just puts in our mind and, and it just grows and grows and grows.

So maybe you speak to the guy out there, just listening Michael, about that has that self doubt. And you know, how can we, how can we combat that? I mean, cuz it’s, it’s big, man. It really holds back a lot of guys.

25:20 Michael McGreevy
It is big. And, you know, it’s, it’s a story that we’ve been telling ourselves about ourself. And usually that comes from an experience that we’ve had in life.

Right? Something happened to us. We made a big mistake. We were hurt in some way. And then as a result of that, our response is that we’ve come up with a story that we tell about ourselves. And so, uh, I think it’s important to take a look back in your life and see what has happened to you and what stories you’re telling yourself as a result.

You know, I, I did that. Um, are you familiar with John Eldridge? Mm-hmm he wrote wild at heart. Yeah. He used to wild at heart. That’s a great book. That’s a great book. Absolutely. But he used to put on retreats. He might still do this. He calls them boot camps. He does. Oh, okay. Yeah, that’s great. So my father and my brother and I used to put on John Eldridge retreats for, for guys, and we’d walk them through this process of, you know, it’s seeing what happened to them.

Like, how are you wounded? How, how are you beat up in life? And then as a result, um, you know, what do you think about yourself because of that? And I was at a retreat one time and it became very clear to me. This is a retreat that I’m leading and I’m having this experience. And God was speaking to me. I was an, an attendee at that treat retrieve really right, is what was happening.

But he brought to mind this experience I had with an adult early on in my childhood, where, um, I was yelled at in a very harsh way. Um, unjustifiably by a Christian man in our church community. And, um, I remember after that experience, I thought, well, I know that I’m justified in what I am thinking right now and what I’m saying, but I can’t even stand up for myself, even when I know that I’m right, I’m such a coward.

And so that whole idea of me being fearful and a coward and ex dealing with a anxiety and low self worth low self-esteem, all that stuff. That was an extension of that experience that I had in my past with that pastor and or with that, uh, member of the church community. So I had to go back and, and find healing from that and realize that that’s a story I’m telling myself about myself as a result of what happened to me.

And it’s not rooted in truth, and it’s not what. God has to say about me or who I am. And, um, and so that’s, that’s what I would recommend is first of all, I, what stories are you telling yourself in your head? What is that negative narrative that’s been rolling around in your head over and over again, like write it down, get it out there and articulate that clearly.

So you can see it in front of you on a piece of paper. Is it I’m not smart to I’m bad at relationships or I’ll never, I always, you know, there’s those sort of statements that we speak over ourselves in our mind and they keep repeating over and over again, we gotta get absolutely clear on what those things are.

Right. And take a look at them on paper. Right. And then the, the second part of that is you gotta find out what’s true all with a few trusted people in your life. Share that share what you wrote with them. Yeah. Hey, this is, this is some of the stuff that’s going on in my mind. This is the narrative that I’m dealing with on a regular basis.

Is this true about me or, or what do you see about me? And right, it might mean some counseling or some healing as a result of walking through some of that stuff. You might need some help navigating that with a pastor or a mentor or a counselor. And there’s an exercise that I do with my clients. And I’m actually happy to share with your audience if they would find it valuable, but it’s a, I have some, an exercise that will guide you through walking back through your past and recording some of those significant events that you’ve experienced.

And then you can actually plot them on a graph and see them from a 30,000 foot view. And instead of that very limited negative hamster wheel, that’s going around in our heads. We get to see a, a wider view and a, in a more accurate picture of our lives so far. And sometimes there’s some really powerful breakthroughs from going through that exercise sometimes you’ll see, oh, it’s I wonder, I think this about myself.

Look what I’ve experienced over the past several years of my life. Or you might see a couple really amazing experiences that you don’t often think about and realize, wow, this tells a completely different story than what I’m saying in my head. And so that’s a, that’s a exercise that I’d highly recommend going through just as a starting point to understanding where are all these thoughts coming from these limited mindsets that you’re dealing with.

Oftentimes, we amplify the negative thoughts and diminish the positive ones that, that we have, especially about ourselves.

30:58 Chris Grainger
You’re all over it. And I definitely would love to have that resource to share with the listeners.

31:03 Michael McGreevy
Absolutely happy to share that. I’ll, I’ll send you a link to that, but, um, after you go through that process of really taking a look and seeing that picture of your life, like to get very clear on what is really true is an important step to, um, and you know, you know, what’s not true.

Like when you start to write out all those negative things that you keep saying about yourself, like that’s, you know, that’s not how God made you. That’s not how he designed you. You were fearfully and wonderfully made. He did not design you to be that way. And so we need to know, well, what is it? What is true?

And to actually ask God about that, right? Like what do you think of me? I know what the world says about me. I know what I say about myself. I know what a lot of my negative experiences say about me, but I need to know what you think about me. Right? And create some space and some silence to listen and to hear from God about that.

And when you do, you will be leveled by what he tells you. Cause it’ll resonate with you so deeply. And, um, back to this retreat experience I had, so here I am, this fearful kid, really inside a man’s body insecure, lacking confidence. And when I asked him that question, which took a lot of time of listening, it didn’t come immediately.

But, you know what he whispered to me that absolutely just like lit a fire in me. He said, you are a fearless warrior. And I was just like, like me do, do you know who I am? Like, do you know the, do you know my struggle with feeling so weak and less than, and cowardly, like, you’re, uh, this guy I’m a fearless warrior and he said it again.

Yeah. You’re a fearless warrior.

33:13 Chris Grainger
And

33:16 Michael McGreevy
I, since hearing those words have not been afraid at all, I haven’t experienced any anxiety. I haven’t experienced any fear that any unhealthy fear. Anyway, I still look both ways before I cross the road. Right. But. In terms of, uh, my identity and who I am, like it’s grounded in him and what he said about me and what he spoke into me and that you can’t mess with what he says mm-hmm

So that changed everything for me. And, um, so that’s, I hope that’s helpful that part of my journey, it, it, um, I don’t know. It might not make a whole lot of sense, but that’s makes a tough, a helpful process for me.

34:10 Chris Grainger
It makes a ton of sense. And I’m, I’m curious on this retreat, was this a men’s retreat? Was there, were there other men there with you?

Yes mm-hmm yeah. Mm-hmm, that, that, that it’s all coming together for me, cuz I mean, I talk about all the time, you know, we are not meant to be an isolation, man. I mean, and, and, and that’s where so many guys live. So let’s take a, a quick break. And then I wanna jump in and ask you a little bit more on, on those negative distortions, because I really think how you overcame those.

There’s, there’s a lot that, that men could learn, you know, from that as they move forward. So we’ll be right back

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Michael, one thing you were talking about those again, taking back to that moment where, you know, our father told you that you are fearless warrior, you were dealing with a, a lot of what I call negative distortions and, and, you know, that’s where I see a lot of guys struggling with you. They either overgeneralize stuff.

Uh, they, they, they label stuff. They blame stuff. Right. And we just get into this, this terrible habit of focusing on that negativity. And then the next thing you know, that it’s just, it’s just like this cloud, we’re just in a fog man. And I’m, I’m kind of working through some things right now, uh, just trying to build myself up confidence and then be able to help others as well.

And I’ve, and I’ve learned those negative distortions, man. We can take control of those. And I mean, we can through the power of the holy spirit as well and prayer, but I feel like so many guys just get stuck there. And it sounds like you were at this group, this retreat with other men, other little warriors by your side.

And all of a sudden, man, you just had that breakthrough. So maybe speak to that for, for the guys that have those negative distortions and they just can’t seem to get past. They just, maybe they, they feel like they’re in a rut, you know? Uh, what, what would be some encouragement, I guess, that you’d offer up.

37:13 Michael McGreevy
Yeah. I think when you’re, when you’re a guy, at least from in my experience, I look at other confident men who are out there and I just assume that’s how they’ve always been. Or they were born that way, born that way. Right? Yeah. Or, you know, uh, they don’t deal with what I deal with. And so it’s, it’s easy.

What you, or what you talked about with isolation that is so crucial because as long as it stays here in between your ears, um, you’re gonna be held captive by it. Mm-hmm and that’s why community is so powerful. And for most men, you’re lucky to have one, maybe two men who are friends that really know you and that you really can go deep with and trust.

Um, but that’s, that’s enough. Like if you can find one that’s enough, but I think you have to be humble enough to be honest with yourself and with somebody else about what you’re really dealing with. Right. And while vulnerability feels like weakness for a lot of guys, it’s the opposite. That is a warrior trait.

The ability to be honest and vulnerable about what’s really going on with you and what you need help with. And, you know, something that’s this big in our heads when we get it out, whether that’s on paper or in front of somebody, it shrinks down to just a fraction of what it is in your head. And so that is huge to have a place where you can be totally real about.

What you’re really going through, you know, there’s this whole idea that, uh, you know, that the stoic sort of Maral man who has a straight face and can handle anything that comes his way. I mean, that is a bunch of BS. We, we all know that now. Yep. Um, oftentimes that guy is a insecure little boy inside when he has that face of that stern face and I can handle it on my own.

I’m, you know, self-made man type of thing, that, that whole idea is bogus. It, it just is not true and it’s not strength and it’s not real masculinity.

39:54 Chris Grainger
It’s not. And I mean, you, it aligns with everything I’m hearing too, Michael, where guys are looking for a community and accountability. I mean, those two areas.

A lot of guys struggle to your point, but if you could just have one to two men that are not yes, men, and that’s one something I struggle with with the church is a lot of times we find those, yes, men in the church. We need those, those 2:00 AM guys, when it’s going down and you call ’em, you know, you can hear ’em putting their pants on and getting their keys.

I mean, they’re on the way, right? I mean, that’s the type of guys we need and then they need to be able, you know, we gotta be real enough to, to speak truth to ’em and let ’em know what’s going on, you know, in our lives and not try to put this facade up. Like, you know, I got all this stuff figured out, just, just be real.

Hey, I am struggling with this. What insight would you have for me? And I just think that’s such a powerful way for men to grow and to overcome insecurity and just something that we don’t do. And, and I like to get your take on this too, because I started really doing this, uh, at home is, is our wives. So many times with our wives, we feel like we have to be like this.

Like our, like the Superman Cape is always behind us and we gotta feel like we’re a Superman. I can tell you for me with, with, with, with my wife very recently, we’ve started praying really intentionally with each other, for each other on what we have going on. And when I’m stressed out or if I’m dealing with some anxiety or whatever’s going on, if I just talk to her about it, you know, and just get it out in the open, I’m not trying to hide it from her anymore.

I just feel like it’s brought us together so much closer, so much tighter. So, you know, instead of trying to feel like I always got it figured out, right. I mean, I can just be real with her. Hey, I’m struggling tonight. Um, just need you to know that. And then she immediately, we’ll just start, bring together and that’s built our relationship.

So any thoughts there on, on, on obviously the, the, the men are important. We gotta find the men, but also our wives.

41:51 Michael McGreevy
Yeah, I that’s powerful. Um, well, I couldn’t have said it better. You know, just being real with people. Um, and I think the misunderstanding is that then you’re, you’ve become a burden on that person or something, or I don’t wanna bug people with my problems.

Uh, you know, that whole thing mm-hmm , but really it’s a gift to that other person. Cause what you’re saying is I trust you enough with my honest, vulnerable feelings that I’m gonna share them with you. Mm-hmm that’s one thing, another thing is it’s giving them the opportunity to offer you support. And that is so encouraging to that person to be able to be relied on by somebody, right?

Like this person’s coming to me and they want my support. Like how, how would that make you feel? Or, or me feel, it feels amazing, right? Oh, they value me enough that I would be called on to support them in their life. And so we gotta get over ourselves and realize that. It’s not a burden. It’s, it’s a gift to other people.

Right. Um, you know, there’s some people that overstep with that and lay all their stuff on somebody else. I’m not talking about those people. I’m talking about people who are very hesitant to share anything because they think they’re supposed to have it all together. Right. Um, those folks, like you give those people who care about you, the gift of allowing them to support you and to be encouraged, like, like what you said, grabbing your wife’s hand and praying with her.

I mean, watching God work as a result, how encouraging is that? I mean, that’s, for both of you, it’s, it’s a gift. And then you talked about the, the other benefit of just the strengthening of your relationship. My goodness. Like how. Awesome as that, when you come together as a couple and you’re struggling through something and trusting God together, that’s when you have that, that three poured rope.

Right. Right. And that’s when you really strengthen your marriage, so right. You said it well, my friend,

44:08 Chris Grainger
well, I mean, and also as guys, you know, we had to be open and have our eyes open all the time, because sometimes like, to your point, you know, guys, we’re not just going, going bear it all sometimes, but there may be hints.

You can U usually for a couple guys that I’m around, I can tell when something’s going on and, you know, versus the, you know, the, the, the Sunday morning. Yeah. Hey, every how’s everybody going, well, we’re doing great. You know, you can, you can pick up on those nuances. And there’s something to be said about, you know, being a lion and leaning in, and actually they can stopping.

If you see somebody struggling. And just having a conversation. And I don’t think we have that enough either. Man. I think too much has relied on email and text. I hate emailing text. I actually like talking to people. I maybe that’s why I like podcasting so much, but it’s just, I think there’s so much value there, man.

And, and, and, and so much could be misinterpreted with a text message versus just picking up the phone and calling a brother and seeing how they’re doing.

45:05 Michael McGreevy
Yeah, no doubt. And also making some space for that too, because more and more, it seems like every year our lives get more and more leveraged and more busy.

And you know, we have to be intentional about creating meaningful interactions like that. And it doesn’t have to be complex if you’re already taking a walk in the morning, bring somebody with you or right. You’re already drinking coffee in the, in the morning, drink coffee with somebody and you’re gonna have lunch.

Join somebody for lunch. So. There’s ways to do that, that don’t have to totally derail your day and, and you can continue to nurture those relationships, but that’s, that’s something I’m working on too. It’s it takes a lot of intention to make that happen.

45:55 Chris Grainger
One, one thing I started, Michael, I like to get your take on is just kind of going to that affirmation part.

I started daily affirmations. I did it. I haven’t been doing it for a long time, so I can’t say I’ve been doing this for years, but you know, I wrote an affirmation list and I wrote an affirmation list for my wife and as well as one for my kids, I’ve be working it with, with them here pretty soon, but it’s just, you know, I wake up, you know, one of the first things I go to and when I do pull my phone up is a, is a daily scripture app, but I’ve trained myself now, after I read that scripture, I go straight to this AF this is just a note.

I pull that affirmation list up and I actually speak ’em out. I, I think it’s about 12 or 14 of them. I’m fearfully and wonderfully made. I’m a great husband. I’m a great dad. Just, I mean, literally just short little sentences, but I feel, you know, by doing that, you know, I, I I’m, I’m fighting Satan right out the gate.

of all the stuff that he’s telling me that I suck at. And I’m just like, Nope, you’re not, you’re not gonna win this battle. So I don’t know, do affirmations as well as maybe other small habits that you’ve, that you have that would help guys that they could, you, you know, actionable and start, you know, how guys are, we want to actually be able to do something that, that would, uh, that you, that you’d offer up here.

47:06 Michael McGreevy
Yeah. I, I like affirmations as a starting point for sure. Um, okay. It’s funny. I was just reading, um, some old Jim Roan books. The, uh, I, I forgot exactly the title, but, um, he was talking about affirmations and he was saying that. If you’re broke and, but you keep saying that you’re rich. What you need to do is affirm that you’re broke.

So then you can start taking the right steps to, to start doing the things that are keep, you know, that are, um, gonna free you from being broke. Right? So I think affirmation is, is powerful as a starting point and then matching up actions to reflect that. I think that’s, that’s really important that you attach those actions, um, that go with it.

But you know what, I’m not gonna have anything revolutionary to say on, on what you need to do. Um, I, I do think that garbage in garbage out is, is a good thing to keep top of mind. And, and there’s a lot to sift through today, right? So, you know, anything that is not. Building you up not growing you as a person that isn’t bringing joy satisfaction, meaning it into your life.

I think it’s important to take an inventory of that and say, okay, if I had to go through my life and, and evaluate like, what videos am I watching? What shows am I watching? What movies am I watching? What news am I taking in? Um, who are the people that are speaking into my life? Like, we, we need to know all those things, because if, if that’s, if there’s some negative, um, inputs going on and we’re taking all that in, we’re gonna get garbage out as well.

And so I think our, our minds are absolutely gardens. And, um, I’m, I love this garden metaphor because I’ve been doing some actual gardening and, um, there’s just so many great metaphors, uh, but. Whatever we choose to put in our minds, it’s gonna grow into something and that’s whether that’s good or bad. And, um, I actually have an exercise on that too, that I’m happy to share where you can walk through and evaluate some of those key areas of your life and, and take a look and see, well, are all the things that are going into my mind and my soul and my spirit.

Are they good things? Are they lifting me up or are they, whatever is lovely. Whatever is honorable. You know, that whole list, um, from the scripture mm-hmm, , mm-hmm , if they’re not, you gotta clean house and make sure you have some good seeds going in so that you get the harvest that you want, cuz whatever is planted in your mind and in your heart, that’s gonna come out in your life too.

So I’m pretty intentional about guarding that and making sure that I have a consistent, um, valuable, um, information and perspectives coming into my, my mind and my heart on a daily basis.

50:10 Chris Grainger
Yeah, I love that garden analogy, man. That’s awesome. Yeah. And, and if you wanna share that, we’ll make sure we sync that, that, that tool up in the notes as well for you guys.

So you can, can grow there, you know, LA kind of the last question on the topic, Michael, then we’ll jump into the lightning, but you know, for, if we have kids, you, maybe they’re struggling with insecurity. What can we, as lions, as you know, leading our families, you know, fathers at home, what, what advice, what can we do to help our kids overcome this insecurity and, and, and build them up as

50:42 Michael McGreevy
well.

Love that question. And I hesitate to give you a, a list because what’s needed more than anything is a, a foundation of love and care and connection. Yeah. If, if, if we don’t have the hours put in, if we don’t have the time spent. Sitting with them on the floor when they’re toddlers playing blocks with them or taking ’em with you as you go to get supplies from home Depot or having conversations with them, um, and working with them on their homework, if you don’t have all that equity built, doesn’t matter what you tell them to do.

They don’t, they’re not gonna listen. Right? They don’t, you don’t have that influencer or that vantage point to speak into their lives. So I would, number one, make sure the relationship is there, make sure you put in the time to build the relationship and make it absolutely clear that you love them. You love spending time with them.

You love to be with them, and then you don’t have to come up with some perfect, uh, you know, speech about what they should believe and how they should think. They’re gonna ask you, they’re gonna bring situations that happened at school to you and get your perspective on that. Right? Cause you have that, that relational equity built.

And so, uh, yeah, that’s, I’m gonna leave it there. Cause I think it’s that important to focus on that over everything is to make sure the relationship there and they, that they really know in whatever way they’re wired. Cuz everybody receives love in different ways. Right. I have one daughter that loves just quality time and I have another son that loves those words of affirmation.

And so you have to dig in and see, how does, how does my child feel loved and how can I make sure they feel loved by me? And then you get the right, you get the privilege of influencing them.

52:53 Chris Grainger
You’re all over it. And I tell, tell guys all the time, you know, so many times as men, we want to try to buy it. But when you buy a kid love the way they spell it’s T I M E I mean, it’s really, they just want your time and you need to show up if you show up and truly care.

And then, you know, they’re just watching you, man. That’s why I also say too, there’s more call than talk. They’re not, they, you can sit in and try to teach ’em, but they’re gonna watch and see how dead he acts. , you know, that’s what they’re gonna remember the most. So, uh, you know, I just, I think that’s worse to remember.

So man, this has been great. I got a lightning round I wanna do with you. So let’s take a break and then come back and we’ll, we’ll go put you into the lines then and, and see

53:36 Michael McGreevy
if you survive. all right, God help me.

53:43 Chris Grainger
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We, we saved the, the end of our, our show. We call it defeating time where we, I got eight questions. I’m gonna fire match. You. Uh, you just come back with the, the best answers you have, you know, for the listeners, he has not been sent these questions. He doesn’t know what’s coming. So it’s, uh, it’s a lot of fun here with this, but, uh, if you’re willing to play, man, we’ll jump in.

Let’s do this. All right. So number one, right out the gate, you know, what’s your favorite thing about God?

55:06 Michael McGreevy
Uh, that’s a tough one. Um, is that a trick question?

55:15 Chris Grainger
no, man, no. Number two is a trick question. Okay.

55:19 Michael McGreevy
Favorite thing about God is how he balances, authority and love.

55:27 Chris Grainger
Love that answer now, number two, what’s your least favorite thing about God

55:33 Michael McGreevy
that I can’t see him.

55:36 Chris Grainger
Yeah. There you go. There you go. Number three. What are you currently struggling with

55:42 Michael McGreevy
too many ideas and not enough time.

55:45 Chris Grainger
Okay. Thinking a lot of guys can relate with that. Number four, you know, what are you most afraid of?

55:52 Michael McGreevy
Not living my life to the fullest. Um, yeah. Missing an opportunity to, to use my gifts to their full capacity.

56:08 Chris Grainger
Mm-hmm mm-hmm that frighten. Totally get that man. Totally get it. Next one. What, what did you spend too much time doing last year?

56:16 Michael McGreevy
Installing trim.

56:19 Chris Grainger
okay. all right. What do you all next? And what do you wish you would have learned sooner about God

56:28 Michael McGreevy
that he loves me first and

56:30 Chris Grainger
foremost? That’s it? That’s it. Two more to go.

You almost survived, man. Number, number seven, give me a new habit that you’re trying to create.

56:40 Michael McGreevy
Uh, my new habit is, uh, walking out in the morning and just in, just looking at my garden and looking at all the plants that are coming up, um, and just enjoying the peace and the quiet of that moment. There

56:57 Chris Grainger
is something about being outside in a garden.

That’s for sure. Mm-hmm and the, the last question, Michael, what’s one thing that you hope the men out there, the lions that you, a lot of guys listen, what do you hope that they remember from this conversation?

57:12 Michael McGreevy
I hope you remember that the negative story that you’ve been telling yourself about yourself is not true and that God has a story to tell you about yourself.

That is something that you are, you would be thrilled about hearing.

57:37 Chris Grainger
It really does. Doesn’t need my friend. Well, Michael, this has been just a powerful conversation. Lots of wisdom, lots of insight for our listeners out there. We’ll make sure we sync up, you know, the resources that you provided in the show notes, but you know, where should people go if they want to connect with you or learn what you’re doing and, and, and, and just be part of, you know, how you’re serving men as well.

57:58 Michael McGreevy
Yeah. I, I like to be accessible. I don’t really care about, uh, protecting my phone or anything like that. Call me if you wanna call me, I’ll give you my number. It’s (716) 713-2957. That’s my cell phone. Give me a ring. If anything resonated with you and you wanna talk about it. If you’d rather email me, just email me@michaelmcreavyleadership.com.

Yeah. And if you want to, if you’re on Instagram, I’m at, at the business of living L I V I N. And, uh, yeah, add me on Facebook or LinkedIn as well.

58:40 Chris Grainger
Awesome. Awesome. We’ll we’ll we’ll make sure all those connections are there, guys in the show notes, go check it out. Connect with Michael. He’s doing some great things.

I’ve been file on him. Love what he posts. I think you posted a picture of that garden the other day. It was beautiful. So, uh, maybe it was your fence or something, but it was awesome. But man, thank you so much for, for, for coming on the line within us today. Michael, is there anything else you’d like to, to get off your chest before we wrap up?

59:03 Michael McGreevy
No, man, I, I appreciate you, Chris. Thank you for having me. I love what you’re doing with, uh, this community. Men need to hear this message including myself. So thank thank you for doing what you’re doing.

59:17 Chris Grainger
All right, guys. That was my conversation with Michael McCreedy. I’ll tell you what, how powerful was that? I mean Michael phenomenal guy. I mean, but that story, I mean, can you imagine the tragedy? And then the second, when the girls were, were, were on the verge of death, I mean, those girls were gonna drown.

He stepped up, he stepped in and then overcoming the insecurity you to hear God tell you that you are a fearless warrior guys. You need to listen. If you’re listening right now, you need to hear this. You are too, you are a lion, you have it inside of you. It’s within us right now. Michael just doubled down, get rid of the negative distortions in your life.

They are holding you back. They’re not true. They are tools from Satan. Don’t give ’em any credence lean into the power that you have. And that power comes from the holy spirit. Understand what is true. And what is true is the unchangeable word of God. You guys got that. You got it. I know you have a passion for it.

That’s why you’re listening for it in line within us, and then protect your mind. You know, he talked about your mind as a garden and that garden, you know, we just, I’m going through this right now. My wife and we, we, we planted all these things in this garden, you know, but if we were plant in our garden, a bunch of weeds, right?

Bunch of, of poisonous plants, they would grow. And they’d probably flourish in our garden, but we choose to plant what’s good. And by planting, what’s good. We’re, we’re ensuring that the goodness will be the fruit. Our minds are same way. So get rid of the negative, prune that stuff out. You need guys that can help you prune that stuff out.

Join the lion dent, and we can help you prune that stuff out. And then start speaking, positive affirmations, start challenging the negative start, letting guys help you move past the negative. That’s what it’s all about. So guys, powerful conversation with Michael Love what he’s doing, love, how he’s serving others.

Highly encourage you to check out, connect with him. Hey, will never had a guest actually give his cell phone number for crying out loud. Hey, it’s there connect with him. Cause that is the type of service that he’s offering to, to try to help people grow. So guys again, powerful conversation today. Don’t forget Isaiah 40, 31.

You know, I want you to have those wings. I want you to soar to soar, but you need to wait on the Lord. You know, I encourage you to go to the line within us, check us out there, check us out the, the, the course that we have that’s available now. So we have the Bible study, but now we have the course. So there’s no excuses guys, self pace work you way through it, you know, guarantee you that you will come through that course.

Stronger more prepared to lead your family against the attacks without a doubt, go check out, you know, the, the blogs that we’re writing, okay. The swag, maybe you wanna align within a shirt or a hat or things like that. Check that out. Maybe just wanna be a donor and just wanna support what we’re doing because you, you, you feel like it’s bringing positive message out there that we need be a donor.

You could be a one time or monthly. We’d love to have you as part of the line within us supporting what we’re doing, guys. This, this is what I try to do every weekend. Week out is serve you with content. That’s gonna help you grow be the Christian leader that you’re predestined to be. I pray that you, that I’m doing that well.

And I’m praying that these messages resonate. I, I would ask that you give us a rating or review that does make a big difference. Promise you. It makes a huge difference. Again, check out the website to line within.us for all our resources. Guys. I pray you have a great week. Pray, have a great day overcome that insecurity.

Just, you need to overcome it. You are a lion that go out and unleash the lion within.